Laura
12-19-2007, 04:28 PM
Laurel: Read this while we get ready for the chat ...
What Happens When Ordinary Travelers Are Treated Like “Terrorists”:
Lost Erla Lillendahl (below), was arrested when she landed in New York Sunday because she had overstayed a US visa more than 10 years ago. She was shackled, denied food, interrogated for two days and not allowed to call relatives. Here she describes her ordeal
During the last twenty-four hours I have probably experienced the greatest humiliation to which I have ever been subjected. During these last twenty-four hours I have been handcuffed and chained, denied the chance to sleep, been without food and drink and been confined to a place without anyone knowing my whereabouts, imprisoned. Now I am beginning to try to understand all this, rest and review the events which began as innocently as possible.
Laurel: Last Sunday I and a few other girls began our trip to New York . We were going to shop and enjoy the Christmas spirit. We made ourselves comfortable on first class, drank white wine and looked forward to go shopping, eat good food and enjoy life. When we landed at JFK airport the traditional clearance process began. We were screened and went on to passport control. As I waited for them to finish examining my passport I heard an official say that there was something which needed to be looked at more closely and I was directed to the work station of Homeland Security. There I was told that according to their records I had overstayed my visa by 3 weeks in 1995. For this reason I would not be admitted to the country and would be sent home on the next flight. I looked at the official in disbelief and told him that I had in fact visited New York after the trip in 1995 without encountering any difficulties. A detailed interrogation session ensued. I was photographed and fingerprinted. I was asked questions which I felt had nothing to do with the issue at hand. I was forbidden to contact anyone to advise of my predicament and although I was invited at the outset to contact the Icelandic consul or embassy, that invitation was later withdrawn. I don't know why. I was then made to wait while they sought further information, and sat on a chair before the authority for 5 hours. I saw the officials in this section handle other cases and it was clear that these were men anxious to demonstrate their power. Small kings with megalomania. I was careful to remain completely cooperative, for I did not yet believe that they planned to deport me because of my "crime". When 5 hours had passed and I had been awake for 24 hours, I was told that they were waiting for officials who would take me to a kind of waiting room. There I would be given a bed to rest in, some food and I would be searched. What they thought they might find I cannot possibly imagine. Finally guards appeared who transported me to the new place. I saw the bed as if in a mirage, for I was absolutely exhausted. What turned out was something else. I was taken to another office exactly like the one where I had been before and once again a long wait ensued. In all, it turned out to be 5 hours. At this office all my things were taken from me. I succeeded in sending a single sms to worried relatives and friends when I was granted a bathroom break. After that the cell phone was taken from me. After I had been sitting for 5 hours I was told that they were now waiting for guards who would take me to a place where I could rest and eat. Then I was placed in a cubicle which looked like an operating room. Attached to the walls were 4 steel plates, probably intended to serve as bed and a toilet. I was exhausted, tired and hungry. I didn't understand the officials’ conduct, for they were treating me like a very dangerous criminal. Soon thereafter I was removed from the cubicle and two armed guards placed me up against a wall. A chain was fastened around my waist and I was handcuffed to the chain. Then my legs were placed in chains. I asked for permission to make a telephone call but they refused. So secured, I was taken from the airport terminal in full sight of everybody. I have seldom felt so bad, so humiliated and all because I had taken a longer vacation than allowed under the law.
(I might have missed a chunk here – LF)
Laurel: They would not tell me where they were taking me. The trip took close to one hour and although I couldn’t see clearly outside the vehicle I knew that we had crossed over into New Jersey . We ended up in front of a jail. I could hardly believe that this was happening. Was I really about to be jailed? I was led inside in the chains and there yet another interrogation session ensued. I was fingerprinted once again and photographed. I was made to undergo a medical examination, I was searched and then I was placed in a jail cell. I was asked absurd questions such as: When did you have your last period? What do you believe in? Have you ever tried to commit suicide?
I was completely exhausted, tired and cold. Fourteen hours after I had landed I had something to eat and drink for the first time. I was given porridge and bread. But it did not help much. I was afraid and the attitude of all who handled me was abysmal to say the least. They did not speak to me as much as snap at me. Once again I asked to make a telephone call and this time the answer was positive. I was relieved but the relief was short-lived. For the telephone was set up for collect calls only and it was not possible to make overseas calls. The jailguard held my cell phone in his hand. I explained to him that I could not make a call from the jail telephone and asked to be allowed to make one call from my own phone. That was out of the question. I spent the next 9 hours in a small, dirty cell. The only thing in there was a narrow steel board which extended out from the wall, a sink and toilet. I wish I never experience again in my life the feeling of confinement and helplessness which I experienced there.
Laurel: I was hugely relieved when, at last, I was told that I was to be taken to the airport, that is to say until I was again handcuffed and chained.Then I could take no more and broke down and cried. I begged them at least to leave out the leg chains but my request was ignored. When we arrived at the airport, another jail guard took pity on me and removed the leg chains. Even so I was led through a full airport terminal handcuffed and escorted by armed men. I felt terrible. On seeing this, people must think that there goes a very dangerous criminal. In this condition I was led up into the Icelandair waiting room, and was kept handcuffed until I entered the embarkation corridor. I was completely run down by all this in both body and spirit. Fortunately I could count on good people and both Einar (the captain) and the crew did all which they could to try to assist me. My friend Aušur was in close contact with my sister and the consul and embassy had been contacted. However, all had received misleading information and all had been told that I had been detained at the airport.
Laurel: Nice, huh?
Ok, back to the chat.
Laurel: Hello everyone. I’m here. First, some preliminaries. What I state in this chat does not constitute legal advice as I have not had the opportunity to review your case. Participation in the chat does not create an attorney-client relationship.
When you type to the chat, I can view what you’ve written, but it will only be visible to everyone in the main window if I post it. I will not have the opportunity to answer every question. I prefer not to answer questions I’ve already answered, when asked by someone else.
lopay: My stepdaughter was ordered removed in 98 by absentia (she about 12 at the time) because she went back to Mexico with her mom before the trial. In 2000 she was paroled into the US for medical reasons. They did not execute the pending removal. Oct 2003 her younger sister was paroled for medical reasons also. This time, “the port director elected to effect the removal of the girls,…”. They effected the removal of both even though only one was paroled. We had no idea this happened because they never told us anything. Nov 2005 we were told in CDJ to return with more documents and an I-212. We were not told what it was for. We hired a lawyer. July 2007, we return to Juarez with the documents and an I-212 application that the lawyer had half filed out. We were turned down again and told that we needed to return with the I-212 waiver. I contacted my senator’s office and they helped me find out why she had been deported in 2003. USCIS told the senator’s office that it would take about 18 months to process the I-212.
(3) Do we actually need the I-212? If we apply for it, by the time they look at it, her 5 year bar will be up. Can we just apply for an appointment assuming that by the time we get one, the bar will be up? If they give us one before, we can ask for a later date.
Laurel: She was paroled in 2000, but did she leave before the parole was up?
lopay: Hi, I have three questions that should prove to be a challenge: (1)How can I find out what evidence the government has against my wife that proves that she reentered without inspection? They say that she reentered without inspection, but I have all kinds of proof that she was in Mexico the whole time. They had a very hard time taking her fingerprints at the consulate, and they didn’t tell us she about this until the fingerprint check came back. (2) How would we go about challenging them about it because we know that she never tried to reenter? We had already filed an I-130 so she had no reason to reenter and we have plenty of affidavits that support what we say.
Laurel: There is no appeal to a consular decision. Advisory Opinions for the Department of State are for questions of law only and you have a question of fact. You have NO RECOURSE. To find out what evidence they might have, you can file a FOIA request, which will take about a year. Even in doing a FOIA, they do not have to give you all the information they have, and it only includes information from your CIS file, not your consular file. This is one of the problems with immigration law.
lopay: she did not overstay anything
Laurel: Humaintarian Parole to enter the US for medical reasons is given for a maximum of one year. B visa to enter for medical reasons is given for six months increments, but needs to be renewed. You can renew past the normal one year limit if its for medical reasons, but if you failed to renew, she overstayed and enforcing the prior deportation order was not improper. She doesn't have unlawful presence toward the 3/10 year bars as she was under 18, but there's no age limit on the 10 year bar following deportaiton.
Klame1983: Laurel, my husband is from Honduras and we will be filing the I-601 sometime next year. I have bipolar disorder, diagnosed in 2005, have been taking medication since then and receive psychotherapy once a month. Would you consider this a strong hardship? And if it depends, what would it depend on? Thanks.
Laurel: It depends on the all the facts of the case, how severe your bipolar disorder is, how well its controlled with medication, how it helps to have your spouse here with you, and how it would hurt for you to move abroad.
mmartinez: Good morning lLaurel. . I was recently approved I601 waiver for my husband in cdj... you might remember my case he was not permitted to file waiver at first because he had an appeal... but then i talked to mr. b and he fixed it for me.. well he is approved.. do i still need to withdraw my appeal.. I called appeals and they still had it there?? why would't cdj have sent them copies of hi lpr... and i also refiled .. i guess i have to cancel that??
Laurel: Congrats on your approval. Just call AAO again and tell them you want to withdraw that appeal and you already made the request. Don't worry too much about it, though since you have your 601 approval now. And don't worry about the refiled forms.
Julio: Hi Laurel! Do you know what legal consequences someone could face for being charging money for immigration services without being a lawyer? There is a person in the Univision forum who made a waiver packet for her friend and it was aproved, then she was asking of how much she should charge for her work. After a few opinions she is going to charge $2000.
Laurel: Practicing law without a license can be charged either as a misdemeanor or a felony, in I believe all 50 states, and whether its charged as misdemeanor or felony usually depends on the number of victims and the total amount of money. If this person is starting to take multiple clients for thousands of dollars each, you're probably looking at a felony. In general, a felony is a crime for which the penalty is one year or more in prison.
laurafern11: From Nepthys: What happens to my husband because of the Class A TB? Does he now have to file (another) waiver before he can come home? We already submitted the I-601 for his unlawful presence in 2006, it was denied, and then we did and MTR and it was approved. When he went for the visa pick-up he had a second medical exam which resulted in some concerns about lung scarring which eventually led to him being admitted to a several-month treatment program. Despite all this, there is still some question as to whether it is TB - if it is TB, and after he completes the treatment, will he have to file another waiver? Right now he is considered medically inadmissible. Does he just become admissible when cleared by the clinic or does he have to file a waiver?
Laurel: If he is determined to be inadmissible due to TB, he will need to file a new I-601, yes.
laurafern11: For Scarface - my son's friend entered the U.S. on a visa and has basically been living and going to school in the U.S. for years. He stays here in the US, then goes to Mexico and comes back every month or so using his tourist visa. He wants to marry his girlfriend, she is a US citizen, but needs to know what to do and about how long the process can take. He is here right now, but as I mentioned he goes to Mexico and crosses back using the visa. Assuming he is over 19 day, will he need a waiver? Should he stop returning to Mexico and just get married and adjust his status? (This is what I, Laura suggested, that he is going to get denied entry one of these times -- better to stop leaving the U.S. and stay put here and pursue AOS asap, because the marriage will forgive any violations of the tourist visa, right?)
Laurel: Depending on how long his visits are, its possilbe he's never violated status. But, if he's going to marry his US citizen girlfriend and become a permanent resident, there will be a time period when he really can't be going back and forth. This time period may be a year or longer.
Luz: I am currently a student and I have become interested in being an immigration attorney. What would you recommend to get a job and experience? My law school does not have an immigration clinic. DO you think attorneys want to hire legal clerks with no experience. Thank You.
Laurel: Nonprofits are desperate for help. You will get experience working at an immigration nonprofit for free. Or, see if you can get a clerkship. No, immigration law firms do not like to hire people who have no experience with immigration. There are more job-seekers than jobs.
Mendoza: Laurel, a friend has been denied for over 2 months now and they still will not let them re-schedule an appointment until they receive the letter. Is there anything they can do? How do they know it is denied and yet they don't have the file? (900# here)
Laurel: You need to pester CIS-CDJ for the denial notice. Calling the 900 number won't help as that's the consulate.
confused: Hello and thanks! I was banned from entering US for 5 years and it was in feb 2001, do I need I212, I was removed for "admission to united states by fraud or by willfully misrepresentinf material fact", I na nutshell so I need I212 after my band has expired ??
Laurel: You triggered two grounds of inadmissibility in 2001: (1) INA 212 a9A because of your deportation; the penalty for that is 5 years, and (2) INA 212 a6Ci because of the misrepresentation; the penalty for that is life. You will always need a waiver. Your ban does not expire.
flower22: When you are doing an in-country waiver with an AOS is it good to put pieces of law pertaining to your case (HSL package) for the adjudicator or just a list of hardships
Laurel: Describing the law is more important for in-country waivers as the immigration officer here in the US does a wider variety of applicaitons than the CIS officers abroad, who do a whole lot of I-601s as well as some I-130s and I-600, etc.
lopay: ? no, she returned in 2000, she did not stay until 2003
Laurel: So, she had already departed again before they executed the deportation order in 2003? Well, then I would fight it and say her ban started when she departed previously and its nearly up.
lopay: can we not sue USCIS or boarder protection?
Laurel: No.
Laurel: In limited circumstances you can sue the government in the US, but not for money. For things that happen abroad, especially at the consulate, its almost impossible. Judicial review is extremely limited in the US and its nearly nonexistant for things that happen outside the US. You don't have what's called "Standing" to bring a suit.
takla: hi laural, if i overstayed in us and that giving me 10 years ban can my mom, who is a permenant residence and my sister is citizen now i left the us what is the steps and action for me to take?what is the first steps?
Laurel: Your mom can be a qualifying relative for the waiver, but right now your problem is visa wait times. You're not an immediate relative, so you'll be put in a preference category. Your visa wait time is probably seven years or more. I'd have to check. But the visa wait times are rediculously long. And it doesn't have anything to do with inadmissibility. Under the current system, its likely that your 10 year bar will be over by the time your visa is available anyway.
Sandra162: If you remember me from previous chats, my cousins husband was arrested in Sept 2002 for solicitation of prostitution. My question is would expunging this from his record help him? Also should this offense be addressed in the hardship letter?
Laurel: Ok, ok, wait here. I'll go look up the prostitution rules.
Laurel: Ok, the rules aren't that bad. Basically, they're just preventing you from getting out of the Petty Offense exception for the first 10 years after the offense. So, he'll need a waiver. Expunging it won't help. He will be inadmissible on criminal grounds as well as any other grounds.
Laurel: But as I said, he can still get the waiver. You just need to talk about what happened and address the issue of rehabilitation.
angela256z: HI Laurel, I have a friend who started working with a lawyer to bring back her husband from El Salvador. They filed their I-130 almost 2 years ago. Because she could not pay the lawyer her next $200 payment (single mom no job and 2 kids) the lawyer refuses to move further. I am assuming she is approved. Is it possible that we can get a new NOA2 for her and continue without the lawyer? Would we just call USCIS and request it eve if she has no application number?
Laurel: You can continue without the lawyer. The only concern is that the case may have been considered abandoned by NVC. You can still get copies of your attorney's file. He can only charge a reasonable copy fee for those copies. If he refuses, contact the state bar for assistance.
Gina: Good morning Laurel. I had a Tb test done 6 years ago and it come out positive, my x-ray was fine but I had to take a 6 months treatment. They told me it was positive b/c I have the TB vaccine. I am really consern about having problems at the medical in CDJ. Should I make a TB waiver before going there or just wait for the results? I'm afraid for what I have red in I2us forum.
Laurel: Bring proof that you've been vaccinated. They're going to do a chest X-ray, so if you actually have active TB, they'll see it.
laurafern11: Re: Nepthys/TB - so say he completes the treatment in 9 months or whatever they make him do, then he will have to file another I-601 waiver for having HAD TB previously?
Laurel: That's possible.
confused: I am not sure how this works so I will ask again. After 5 years ban has expired am I free to enter US again? I am Canadian citizen if that matters. Or do I still need I212 even if my ban has passed in 2006? Thanks!
Laurel: The five-year ban only applies to the deportation, not the misrepresentation. You are inadmssible under INA 212 a6Ci for the misrepresenation for the rest of your life. That bar does not expire. You will always need a waiver. But you would either need a nonimmigrant waiver (file I-192) or immigrant waiver (file I-601). You will no longer need an I-212.
flower22: Also, my husband has worked with a ITIN # just for one calendar year. (which is not valid for work but he has used it anyway and he employer accepted it). Will he be in jeopardy when we go for our AOS interview based on this fact?
Laurel: As long as he entered on a valid visa, such as a B or F, and is currently married to a USC and there are no other grounds of inadmissibility, you should be fine.
mach12: Is there a way to find out, phone or email, when our K3 interview will be before we get the appt letter? I will be in Mexico and I would like to know as soon as possible. Dont want to rely on lovely lawyer of mine to communicate that oh so important fact. Thanks.
Laurel: I don't recommend calling them a whole lot in an attempt to find out when your appointment is, when you haven't gotten an appointment letter yet. But you can try calling the 900 number.
flower22: one more question. Since we are scheduled for an interview in the US (AOS + I-601 waiver of missrepresentation) can in anyway the adjudicator tell us that we are not eligibile to do an in country adjustment (do it outside of US) when at the same time the National Benefits Center has already processed us and scheduled the interview in the US
Laurel: This is a matter of debate among attorneys. The legal question is: "If your admission to the US was procured through fraud, is that an admission for purposes of INA 245(a)?" And the answer is: "Maybe". Currently most local CIS offices say "yes", but if you get one that says "no", there's not a whole lot you can do except bring it to an immigration judge and maybe get the issue on appeal and have the BIA give us all a consistent policy to follow.
confused: Thanks, this is really bad news, maybe I can add another questions, is I212 good for a period of time or is it necessary to resubmit it for every trip?
Laurel: The I-212 is a permanent waiver of the deportaiton, but you have the misrepresentation and you don't waive that with an I-212. You need either an I-192 or an I-601.
cm21om25: Laurel, Can depression count as a hardship? If so, in what circumstances?
Laurel: It might, but usually not so much. It depends on how severe it is.
takla: laural i left the us volunterly and overstayed cause my mother medical condition and i was i the only support for her at that time can she apply for me?
Laurel: Yes, but as I said, its going to take a very, very long time and that doesn't really have anything to do without your ground of inadmissibility. That's just visa wait times.
luisa: hi Laurel. I lived in USA for around 7 years I didn't have permission to live in the .country, my husband in that mment was american resident. I have 3 children in USA , and I made the biggest mistake in my life, I decided to go to Mexico to see my parents that I missed too much. So I didn't know at the time my husband become USC I had the rights to enter to USA without problem, obvious it wouldn't happend , and I understand that later . So I was very confused at that tie , my husband become usc inmidiatly and applied the 1 130 for me, It was in 2001 when he applied, and in 2005 I had the interview in cdj , I filed out a waiver and in 2006 it was denied because the hard sheet letter was very lack , Im very dessesperate, my husband is in USA and applied again for a new 1 130 because the lawyer he hired tried to get a new interview but nothing hapened , he didn't recived a new date for interview , s he decided to applied this october 2007 for a new 1 130 , I'm in Mexico for around 6 years and I very sad, deppresed , please , do you think that the new 1 130 will be process soon? My husband applied this october 2007 and I didn't recived any form yet
Laurel: You need a waiver of inadmissibility. Have you filed that yet???
ladybug: laurel, i have another question an additional to the e-mail i sent you. will panama send a receipt notice for the MTR that was submitted??
Laurel: No they will not. It is not normal for them to notify us that everything was received ok. Check and see if the payment was cashed.
Angelito21: Hi Laurel - My husband was sent to backlog in October. He had a misdemeanor where the charges were dropped. The boxes checked on the sheet were 1) more hardship evidence 2) needed to further review FBI/police records. My question: Should he write an apology letter for this incident? Last week, you said the person should not write an apology letter for entering the country because he's accepting he did something wrong. How about in this case? I'm finalizing my package and I want to include everything that could benefit him. Thanks in advance for your answer.
Laurel: Not exactly an apology letter - especially when the charges were dropped. He needs to write a letter explaining what happened.
Laurel: Not the same thing as an apology.
plane-jane: hi! I am a LPR in US. I filed a I-130 for my son who lives in Europe and is over 21 years old. The I-130 was just approved. What other steps should I take? On the I-130 it says that I have to send the docs to the Beneficiary. What documents are they talking about? Am I not supposed to continue the process in the US?
Laurel: It probably says that your son will be notified. But if that's not what it says, I'd have to look at your notice.
lopay: but this happened in the US. we want to challenge the reentery without inspection in 2003. They said that she reentered in tx, so we would be challengeing what the boarder patrol did. We don't have a problem with the consulate. He denied us because of what the boarder patrol put in the computer. They are law enforcement, so can we do anything about them? Would it not be the same as us asking why they executed the removal in 2003 instead of 2000?
Laurel: Right. Ok. They're saying she reentered in 2003 and you're saying she didn't. Question of fact. She's outside the US. You have no recourse.
Laurel: Well, if its really a 9C issue that's the problem, then you could try an Advisory Opinion arguing that 9C doesn't apply because of her age. But I think you said they're willing to take her I-212, so it doesn't sound like a 9C problem and there's no question of law to be reviewed, only question of fact.
luisa: yes I filled it in 2005 but it was denied because the hard sheet letter was lack of evidences , so my husban decided to apply this october 2007 for a new 1 130 , but we didn't recive any form yet , he hired a lawyer, remember , I have been in MExico for around 6 years
Laurel: You just need to file a better waiver this time
Angelito21: Laurel - Also, If you get a chance...What do you think about the message (I believe) int he USCIS website saying they plan to clear the waiver backlog by March 2008? Just curious what your opinion is.
Laurel: They're trying to get all 601 cases in Latin America decided in less than 6 months.
cm21om25: I am going to look to see how severe my depression is and I will let you know. All I know is it has gotten a lot worse lately.
Laurel: You will be compared to all the other people claiming depression on the I-601s, which includes pretty much EVERYONE. If your level of depression is the same as everyone else's, it will be considered 'normal' hardship, not 'extreme' hardship.
sandy: A friend of mine had her interview in Jan.2007 and she just received the approval .We filed the exact date and was enter into the system with one day of difference. Do you think I should get any response back for mine any time soon (I601) in CDJ
Laurel: Soon, yes.
mach12: packet assembly: legal brief, table of contents: first exhibit is my hsl then rest of exhibits is my supp. docs. is this right? numbered tabs at bottom? plain white ok? (he showed me a sample with white tabs)
Laurel: I don't use tabs. But if you want to use tabs, use tabs.
Mendoza: Laurel, please let everyone know that it is the visa backlog they want to clear by March 2008, NOT the waiver backlog!
Laurel: I think its both.
lopay: so the only option for my wife is to wait until 2013?
Laurel: If they're letting you file the I-212, then file it.
cm21om25: what about someone that has a history of deppression? I was diagnosed with depression in the 6th grade. Does help or not help?
Laurel: It depends.
lopay: the reentery is for my wife, the I-212 is for my step daugher. two different cases
Laurel: Oh, that's confusing. So your wife has been found inadmissible under 9C?
dduran: Hi Laurel, Just what to wish you a Merry Christmas hope Santa is good to you....
Laurel: Thank you.
Laurel: I'm a little anxious right now. While on the chat, a client whose waiver is pending called and said she had bad news. I told her we'd talk as soon as the chat was over. I'm pretty unhappy right now.
lopay: the I-212 was only for my stepdaugher, not my wife. They told us that she was banned until 2013
Laurel: Then yes, sounds like you may have to wait until 2013.
Laurel: Ok, its noon. I'm going to have to sign off. I should still be doing the chat next week, which is the day after Christmas. See you then.
What Happens When Ordinary Travelers Are Treated Like “Terrorists”:
Lost Erla Lillendahl (below), was arrested when she landed in New York Sunday because she had overstayed a US visa more than 10 years ago. She was shackled, denied food, interrogated for two days and not allowed to call relatives. Here she describes her ordeal
During the last twenty-four hours I have probably experienced the greatest humiliation to which I have ever been subjected. During these last twenty-four hours I have been handcuffed and chained, denied the chance to sleep, been without food and drink and been confined to a place without anyone knowing my whereabouts, imprisoned. Now I am beginning to try to understand all this, rest and review the events which began as innocently as possible.
Laurel: Last Sunday I and a few other girls began our trip to New York . We were going to shop and enjoy the Christmas spirit. We made ourselves comfortable on first class, drank white wine and looked forward to go shopping, eat good food and enjoy life. When we landed at JFK airport the traditional clearance process began. We were screened and went on to passport control. As I waited for them to finish examining my passport I heard an official say that there was something which needed to be looked at more closely and I was directed to the work station of Homeland Security. There I was told that according to their records I had overstayed my visa by 3 weeks in 1995. For this reason I would not be admitted to the country and would be sent home on the next flight. I looked at the official in disbelief and told him that I had in fact visited New York after the trip in 1995 without encountering any difficulties. A detailed interrogation session ensued. I was photographed and fingerprinted. I was asked questions which I felt had nothing to do with the issue at hand. I was forbidden to contact anyone to advise of my predicament and although I was invited at the outset to contact the Icelandic consul or embassy, that invitation was later withdrawn. I don't know why. I was then made to wait while they sought further information, and sat on a chair before the authority for 5 hours. I saw the officials in this section handle other cases and it was clear that these were men anxious to demonstrate their power. Small kings with megalomania. I was careful to remain completely cooperative, for I did not yet believe that they planned to deport me because of my "crime". When 5 hours had passed and I had been awake for 24 hours, I was told that they were waiting for officials who would take me to a kind of waiting room. There I would be given a bed to rest in, some food and I would be searched. What they thought they might find I cannot possibly imagine. Finally guards appeared who transported me to the new place. I saw the bed as if in a mirage, for I was absolutely exhausted. What turned out was something else. I was taken to another office exactly like the one where I had been before and once again a long wait ensued. In all, it turned out to be 5 hours. At this office all my things were taken from me. I succeeded in sending a single sms to worried relatives and friends when I was granted a bathroom break. After that the cell phone was taken from me. After I had been sitting for 5 hours I was told that they were now waiting for guards who would take me to a place where I could rest and eat. Then I was placed in a cubicle which looked like an operating room. Attached to the walls were 4 steel plates, probably intended to serve as bed and a toilet. I was exhausted, tired and hungry. I didn't understand the officials’ conduct, for they were treating me like a very dangerous criminal. Soon thereafter I was removed from the cubicle and two armed guards placed me up against a wall. A chain was fastened around my waist and I was handcuffed to the chain. Then my legs were placed in chains. I asked for permission to make a telephone call but they refused. So secured, I was taken from the airport terminal in full sight of everybody. I have seldom felt so bad, so humiliated and all because I had taken a longer vacation than allowed under the law.
(I might have missed a chunk here – LF)
Laurel: They would not tell me where they were taking me. The trip took close to one hour and although I couldn’t see clearly outside the vehicle I knew that we had crossed over into New Jersey . We ended up in front of a jail. I could hardly believe that this was happening. Was I really about to be jailed? I was led inside in the chains and there yet another interrogation session ensued. I was fingerprinted once again and photographed. I was made to undergo a medical examination, I was searched and then I was placed in a jail cell. I was asked absurd questions such as: When did you have your last period? What do you believe in? Have you ever tried to commit suicide?
I was completely exhausted, tired and cold. Fourteen hours after I had landed I had something to eat and drink for the first time. I was given porridge and bread. But it did not help much. I was afraid and the attitude of all who handled me was abysmal to say the least. They did not speak to me as much as snap at me. Once again I asked to make a telephone call and this time the answer was positive. I was relieved but the relief was short-lived. For the telephone was set up for collect calls only and it was not possible to make overseas calls. The jailguard held my cell phone in his hand. I explained to him that I could not make a call from the jail telephone and asked to be allowed to make one call from my own phone. That was out of the question. I spent the next 9 hours in a small, dirty cell. The only thing in there was a narrow steel board which extended out from the wall, a sink and toilet. I wish I never experience again in my life the feeling of confinement and helplessness which I experienced there.
Laurel: I was hugely relieved when, at last, I was told that I was to be taken to the airport, that is to say until I was again handcuffed and chained.Then I could take no more and broke down and cried. I begged them at least to leave out the leg chains but my request was ignored. When we arrived at the airport, another jail guard took pity on me and removed the leg chains. Even so I was led through a full airport terminal handcuffed and escorted by armed men. I felt terrible. On seeing this, people must think that there goes a very dangerous criminal. In this condition I was led up into the Icelandair waiting room, and was kept handcuffed until I entered the embarkation corridor. I was completely run down by all this in both body and spirit. Fortunately I could count on good people and both Einar (the captain) and the crew did all which they could to try to assist me. My friend Aušur was in close contact with my sister and the consul and embassy had been contacted. However, all had received misleading information and all had been told that I had been detained at the airport.
Laurel: Nice, huh?
Ok, back to the chat.
Laurel: Hello everyone. I’m here. First, some preliminaries. What I state in this chat does not constitute legal advice as I have not had the opportunity to review your case. Participation in the chat does not create an attorney-client relationship.
When you type to the chat, I can view what you’ve written, but it will only be visible to everyone in the main window if I post it. I will not have the opportunity to answer every question. I prefer not to answer questions I’ve already answered, when asked by someone else.
lopay: My stepdaughter was ordered removed in 98 by absentia (she about 12 at the time) because she went back to Mexico with her mom before the trial. In 2000 she was paroled into the US for medical reasons. They did not execute the pending removal. Oct 2003 her younger sister was paroled for medical reasons also. This time, “the port director elected to effect the removal of the girls,…”. They effected the removal of both even though only one was paroled. We had no idea this happened because they never told us anything. Nov 2005 we were told in CDJ to return with more documents and an I-212. We were not told what it was for. We hired a lawyer. July 2007, we return to Juarez with the documents and an I-212 application that the lawyer had half filed out. We were turned down again and told that we needed to return with the I-212 waiver. I contacted my senator’s office and they helped me find out why she had been deported in 2003. USCIS told the senator’s office that it would take about 18 months to process the I-212.
(3) Do we actually need the I-212? If we apply for it, by the time they look at it, her 5 year bar will be up. Can we just apply for an appointment assuming that by the time we get one, the bar will be up? If they give us one before, we can ask for a later date.
Laurel: She was paroled in 2000, but did she leave before the parole was up?
lopay: Hi, I have three questions that should prove to be a challenge: (1)How can I find out what evidence the government has against my wife that proves that she reentered without inspection? They say that she reentered without inspection, but I have all kinds of proof that she was in Mexico the whole time. They had a very hard time taking her fingerprints at the consulate, and they didn’t tell us she about this until the fingerprint check came back. (2) How would we go about challenging them about it because we know that she never tried to reenter? We had already filed an I-130 so she had no reason to reenter and we have plenty of affidavits that support what we say.
Laurel: There is no appeal to a consular decision. Advisory Opinions for the Department of State are for questions of law only and you have a question of fact. You have NO RECOURSE. To find out what evidence they might have, you can file a FOIA request, which will take about a year. Even in doing a FOIA, they do not have to give you all the information they have, and it only includes information from your CIS file, not your consular file. This is one of the problems with immigration law.
lopay: she did not overstay anything
Laurel: Humaintarian Parole to enter the US for medical reasons is given for a maximum of one year. B visa to enter for medical reasons is given for six months increments, but needs to be renewed. You can renew past the normal one year limit if its for medical reasons, but if you failed to renew, she overstayed and enforcing the prior deportation order was not improper. She doesn't have unlawful presence toward the 3/10 year bars as she was under 18, but there's no age limit on the 10 year bar following deportaiton.
Klame1983: Laurel, my husband is from Honduras and we will be filing the I-601 sometime next year. I have bipolar disorder, diagnosed in 2005, have been taking medication since then and receive psychotherapy once a month. Would you consider this a strong hardship? And if it depends, what would it depend on? Thanks.
Laurel: It depends on the all the facts of the case, how severe your bipolar disorder is, how well its controlled with medication, how it helps to have your spouse here with you, and how it would hurt for you to move abroad.
mmartinez: Good morning lLaurel. . I was recently approved I601 waiver for my husband in cdj... you might remember my case he was not permitted to file waiver at first because he had an appeal... but then i talked to mr. b and he fixed it for me.. well he is approved.. do i still need to withdraw my appeal.. I called appeals and they still had it there?? why would't cdj have sent them copies of hi lpr... and i also refiled .. i guess i have to cancel that??
Laurel: Congrats on your approval. Just call AAO again and tell them you want to withdraw that appeal and you already made the request. Don't worry too much about it, though since you have your 601 approval now. And don't worry about the refiled forms.
Julio: Hi Laurel! Do you know what legal consequences someone could face for being charging money for immigration services without being a lawyer? There is a person in the Univision forum who made a waiver packet for her friend and it was aproved, then she was asking of how much she should charge for her work. After a few opinions she is going to charge $2000.
Laurel: Practicing law without a license can be charged either as a misdemeanor or a felony, in I believe all 50 states, and whether its charged as misdemeanor or felony usually depends on the number of victims and the total amount of money. If this person is starting to take multiple clients for thousands of dollars each, you're probably looking at a felony. In general, a felony is a crime for which the penalty is one year or more in prison.
laurafern11: From Nepthys: What happens to my husband because of the Class A TB? Does he now have to file (another) waiver before he can come home? We already submitted the I-601 for his unlawful presence in 2006, it was denied, and then we did and MTR and it was approved. When he went for the visa pick-up he had a second medical exam which resulted in some concerns about lung scarring which eventually led to him being admitted to a several-month treatment program. Despite all this, there is still some question as to whether it is TB - if it is TB, and after he completes the treatment, will he have to file another waiver? Right now he is considered medically inadmissible. Does he just become admissible when cleared by the clinic or does he have to file a waiver?
Laurel: If he is determined to be inadmissible due to TB, he will need to file a new I-601, yes.
laurafern11: For Scarface - my son's friend entered the U.S. on a visa and has basically been living and going to school in the U.S. for years. He stays here in the US, then goes to Mexico and comes back every month or so using his tourist visa. He wants to marry his girlfriend, she is a US citizen, but needs to know what to do and about how long the process can take. He is here right now, but as I mentioned he goes to Mexico and crosses back using the visa. Assuming he is over 19 day, will he need a waiver? Should he stop returning to Mexico and just get married and adjust his status? (This is what I, Laura suggested, that he is going to get denied entry one of these times -- better to stop leaving the U.S. and stay put here and pursue AOS asap, because the marriage will forgive any violations of the tourist visa, right?)
Laurel: Depending on how long his visits are, its possilbe he's never violated status. But, if he's going to marry his US citizen girlfriend and become a permanent resident, there will be a time period when he really can't be going back and forth. This time period may be a year or longer.
Luz: I am currently a student and I have become interested in being an immigration attorney. What would you recommend to get a job and experience? My law school does not have an immigration clinic. DO you think attorneys want to hire legal clerks with no experience. Thank You.
Laurel: Nonprofits are desperate for help. You will get experience working at an immigration nonprofit for free. Or, see if you can get a clerkship. No, immigration law firms do not like to hire people who have no experience with immigration. There are more job-seekers than jobs.
Mendoza: Laurel, a friend has been denied for over 2 months now and they still will not let them re-schedule an appointment until they receive the letter. Is there anything they can do? How do they know it is denied and yet they don't have the file? (900# here)
Laurel: You need to pester CIS-CDJ for the denial notice. Calling the 900 number won't help as that's the consulate.
confused: Hello and thanks! I was banned from entering US for 5 years and it was in feb 2001, do I need I212, I was removed for "admission to united states by fraud or by willfully misrepresentinf material fact", I na nutshell so I need I212 after my band has expired ??
Laurel: You triggered two grounds of inadmissibility in 2001: (1) INA 212 a9A because of your deportation; the penalty for that is 5 years, and (2) INA 212 a6Ci because of the misrepresentation; the penalty for that is life. You will always need a waiver. Your ban does not expire.
flower22: When you are doing an in-country waiver with an AOS is it good to put pieces of law pertaining to your case (HSL package) for the adjudicator or just a list of hardships
Laurel: Describing the law is more important for in-country waivers as the immigration officer here in the US does a wider variety of applicaitons than the CIS officers abroad, who do a whole lot of I-601s as well as some I-130s and I-600, etc.
lopay: ? no, she returned in 2000, she did not stay until 2003
Laurel: So, she had already departed again before they executed the deportation order in 2003? Well, then I would fight it and say her ban started when she departed previously and its nearly up.
lopay: can we not sue USCIS or boarder protection?
Laurel: No.
Laurel: In limited circumstances you can sue the government in the US, but not for money. For things that happen abroad, especially at the consulate, its almost impossible. Judicial review is extremely limited in the US and its nearly nonexistant for things that happen outside the US. You don't have what's called "Standing" to bring a suit.
takla: hi laural, if i overstayed in us and that giving me 10 years ban can my mom, who is a permenant residence and my sister is citizen now i left the us what is the steps and action for me to take?what is the first steps?
Laurel: Your mom can be a qualifying relative for the waiver, but right now your problem is visa wait times. You're not an immediate relative, so you'll be put in a preference category. Your visa wait time is probably seven years or more. I'd have to check. But the visa wait times are rediculously long. And it doesn't have anything to do with inadmissibility. Under the current system, its likely that your 10 year bar will be over by the time your visa is available anyway.
Sandra162: If you remember me from previous chats, my cousins husband was arrested in Sept 2002 for solicitation of prostitution. My question is would expunging this from his record help him? Also should this offense be addressed in the hardship letter?
Laurel: Ok, ok, wait here. I'll go look up the prostitution rules.
Laurel: Ok, the rules aren't that bad. Basically, they're just preventing you from getting out of the Petty Offense exception for the first 10 years after the offense. So, he'll need a waiver. Expunging it won't help. He will be inadmissible on criminal grounds as well as any other grounds.
Laurel: But as I said, he can still get the waiver. You just need to talk about what happened and address the issue of rehabilitation.
angela256z: HI Laurel, I have a friend who started working with a lawyer to bring back her husband from El Salvador. They filed their I-130 almost 2 years ago. Because she could not pay the lawyer her next $200 payment (single mom no job and 2 kids) the lawyer refuses to move further. I am assuming she is approved. Is it possible that we can get a new NOA2 for her and continue without the lawyer? Would we just call USCIS and request it eve if she has no application number?
Laurel: You can continue without the lawyer. The only concern is that the case may have been considered abandoned by NVC. You can still get copies of your attorney's file. He can only charge a reasonable copy fee for those copies. If he refuses, contact the state bar for assistance.
Gina: Good morning Laurel. I had a Tb test done 6 years ago and it come out positive, my x-ray was fine but I had to take a 6 months treatment. They told me it was positive b/c I have the TB vaccine. I am really consern about having problems at the medical in CDJ. Should I make a TB waiver before going there or just wait for the results? I'm afraid for what I have red in I2us forum.
Laurel: Bring proof that you've been vaccinated. They're going to do a chest X-ray, so if you actually have active TB, they'll see it.
laurafern11: Re: Nepthys/TB - so say he completes the treatment in 9 months or whatever they make him do, then he will have to file another I-601 waiver for having HAD TB previously?
Laurel: That's possible.
confused: I am not sure how this works so I will ask again. After 5 years ban has expired am I free to enter US again? I am Canadian citizen if that matters. Or do I still need I212 even if my ban has passed in 2006? Thanks!
Laurel: The five-year ban only applies to the deportation, not the misrepresentation. You are inadmssible under INA 212 a6Ci for the misrepresenation for the rest of your life. That bar does not expire. You will always need a waiver. But you would either need a nonimmigrant waiver (file I-192) or immigrant waiver (file I-601). You will no longer need an I-212.
flower22: Also, my husband has worked with a ITIN # just for one calendar year. (which is not valid for work but he has used it anyway and he employer accepted it). Will he be in jeopardy when we go for our AOS interview based on this fact?
Laurel: As long as he entered on a valid visa, such as a B or F, and is currently married to a USC and there are no other grounds of inadmissibility, you should be fine.
mach12: Is there a way to find out, phone or email, when our K3 interview will be before we get the appt letter? I will be in Mexico and I would like to know as soon as possible. Dont want to rely on lovely lawyer of mine to communicate that oh so important fact. Thanks.
Laurel: I don't recommend calling them a whole lot in an attempt to find out when your appointment is, when you haven't gotten an appointment letter yet. But you can try calling the 900 number.
flower22: one more question. Since we are scheduled for an interview in the US (AOS + I-601 waiver of missrepresentation) can in anyway the adjudicator tell us that we are not eligibile to do an in country adjustment (do it outside of US) when at the same time the National Benefits Center has already processed us and scheduled the interview in the US
Laurel: This is a matter of debate among attorneys. The legal question is: "If your admission to the US was procured through fraud, is that an admission for purposes of INA 245(a)?" And the answer is: "Maybe". Currently most local CIS offices say "yes", but if you get one that says "no", there's not a whole lot you can do except bring it to an immigration judge and maybe get the issue on appeal and have the BIA give us all a consistent policy to follow.
confused: Thanks, this is really bad news, maybe I can add another questions, is I212 good for a period of time or is it necessary to resubmit it for every trip?
Laurel: The I-212 is a permanent waiver of the deportaiton, but you have the misrepresentation and you don't waive that with an I-212. You need either an I-192 or an I-601.
cm21om25: Laurel, Can depression count as a hardship? If so, in what circumstances?
Laurel: It might, but usually not so much. It depends on how severe it is.
takla: laural i left the us volunterly and overstayed cause my mother medical condition and i was i the only support for her at that time can she apply for me?
Laurel: Yes, but as I said, its going to take a very, very long time and that doesn't really have anything to do without your ground of inadmissibility. That's just visa wait times.
luisa: hi Laurel. I lived in USA for around 7 years I didn't have permission to live in the .country, my husband in that mment was american resident. I have 3 children in USA , and I made the biggest mistake in my life, I decided to go to Mexico to see my parents that I missed too much. So I didn't know at the time my husband become USC I had the rights to enter to USA without problem, obvious it wouldn't happend , and I understand that later . So I was very confused at that tie , my husband become usc inmidiatly and applied the 1 130 for me, It was in 2001 when he applied, and in 2005 I had the interview in cdj , I filed out a waiver and in 2006 it was denied because the hard sheet letter was very lack , Im very dessesperate, my husband is in USA and applied again for a new 1 130 because the lawyer he hired tried to get a new interview but nothing hapened , he didn't recived a new date for interview , s he decided to applied this october 2007 for a new 1 130 , I'm in Mexico for around 6 years and I very sad, deppresed , please , do you think that the new 1 130 will be process soon? My husband applied this october 2007 and I didn't recived any form yet
Laurel: You need a waiver of inadmissibility. Have you filed that yet???
ladybug: laurel, i have another question an additional to the e-mail i sent you. will panama send a receipt notice for the MTR that was submitted??
Laurel: No they will not. It is not normal for them to notify us that everything was received ok. Check and see if the payment was cashed.
Angelito21: Hi Laurel - My husband was sent to backlog in October. He had a misdemeanor where the charges were dropped. The boxes checked on the sheet were 1) more hardship evidence 2) needed to further review FBI/police records. My question: Should he write an apology letter for this incident? Last week, you said the person should not write an apology letter for entering the country because he's accepting he did something wrong. How about in this case? I'm finalizing my package and I want to include everything that could benefit him. Thanks in advance for your answer.
Laurel: Not exactly an apology letter - especially when the charges were dropped. He needs to write a letter explaining what happened.
Laurel: Not the same thing as an apology.
plane-jane: hi! I am a LPR in US. I filed a I-130 for my son who lives in Europe and is over 21 years old. The I-130 was just approved. What other steps should I take? On the I-130 it says that I have to send the docs to the Beneficiary. What documents are they talking about? Am I not supposed to continue the process in the US?
Laurel: It probably says that your son will be notified. But if that's not what it says, I'd have to look at your notice.
lopay: but this happened in the US. we want to challenge the reentery without inspection in 2003. They said that she reentered in tx, so we would be challengeing what the boarder patrol did. We don't have a problem with the consulate. He denied us because of what the boarder patrol put in the computer. They are law enforcement, so can we do anything about them? Would it not be the same as us asking why they executed the removal in 2003 instead of 2000?
Laurel: Right. Ok. They're saying she reentered in 2003 and you're saying she didn't. Question of fact. She's outside the US. You have no recourse.
Laurel: Well, if its really a 9C issue that's the problem, then you could try an Advisory Opinion arguing that 9C doesn't apply because of her age. But I think you said they're willing to take her I-212, so it doesn't sound like a 9C problem and there's no question of law to be reviewed, only question of fact.
luisa: yes I filled it in 2005 but it was denied because the hard sheet letter was lack of evidences , so my husban decided to apply this october 2007 for a new 1 130 , but we didn't recive any form yet , he hired a lawyer, remember , I have been in MExico for around 6 years
Laurel: You just need to file a better waiver this time
Angelito21: Laurel - Also, If you get a chance...What do you think about the message (I believe) int he USCIS website saying they plan to clear the waiver backlog by March 2008? Just curious what your opinion is.
Laurel: They're trying to get all 601 cases in Latin America decided in less than 6 months.
cm21om25: I am going to look to see how severe my depression is and I will let you know. All I know is it has gotten a lot worse lately.
Laurel: You will be compared to all the other people claiming depression on the I-601s, which includes pretty much EVERYONE. If your level of depression is the same as everyone else's, it will be considered 'normal' hardship, not 'extreme' hardship.
sandy: A friend of mine had her interview in Jan.2007 and she just received the approval .We filed the exact date and was enter into the system with one day of difference. Do you think I should get any response back for mine any time soon (I601) in CDJ
Laurel: Soon, yes.
mach12: packet assembly: legal brief, table of contents: first exhibit is my hsl then rest of exhibits is my supp. docs. is this right? numbered tabs at bottom? plain white ok? (he showed me a sample with white tabs)
Laurel: I don't use tabs. But if you want to use tabs, use tabs.
Mendoza: Laurel, please let everyone know that it is the visa backlog they want to clear by March 2008, NOT the waiver backlog!
Laurel: I think its both.
lopay: so the only option for my wife is to wait until 2013?
Laurel: If they're letting you file the I-212, then file it.
cm21om25: what about someone that has a history of deppression? I was diagnosed with depression in the 6th grade. Does help or not help?
Laurel: It depends.
lopay: the reentery is for my wife, the I-212 is for my step daugher. two different cases
Laurel: Oh, that's confusing. So your wife has been found inadmissible under 9C?
dduran: Hi Laurel, Just what to wish you a Merry Christmas hope Santa is good to you....
Laurel: Thank you.
Laurel: I'm a little anxious right now. While on the chat, a client whose waiver is pending called and said she had bad news. I told her we'd talk as soon as the chat was over. I'm pretty unhappy right now.
lopay: the I-212 was only for my stepdaugher, not my wife. They told us that she was banned until 2013
Laurel: Then yes, sounds like you may have to wait until 2013.
Laurel: Ok, its noon. I'm going to have to sign off. I should still be doing the chat next week, which is the day after Christmas. See you then.