I'm LOST

[lisamarie6801]

Please forgive me if I'm repeating a prior question. I'm totally lost, exhausted w/ looking online and just need the steps I need to take. I'll keep it as short and sweet as possible.

My and my now fiance met online in late 2001. We kept frequent contact over the years. Earlier this year, we decided we wanted to take it further. I by the way am a US citizen who works for the government. He is a canadian citizen. He has visited the US before but does not have a passport. He applied for one earlier this year, but we got impatient so I DROVE to Nova Scotia with plans of bringing him here. His Canadian DL states that he lives in Essex Ontario. So we planned on telling customs that we were going to cross thru to Buffalo to take him home to Essex vs. driving all the way around Canada. He packed his things, we reached the New Brunswick customs. We lied. 5 hours in the customs office and they determined that we were lying. They "arrested" him, fingerprinted etc. and served him with 2 papers. One being Determination of Inadmissibility. They found him inadmissable to the US under section 212(a)(7)(A)(i)(I). Which basically states

(i) In general.-Any nonimmigrant who-

(I) is not in possession of a passport valid for a minimum of six months from the date of the expiration of the initial period of the alien's admission or contemplated initial period of stay authorizing the alien to return to the country from which the alien came or to proceed to and enter some other country during such period

according to this site:
http://travel.state.gov/visa/frvi/ineligibilities/ineligibilities_1364.html

At the bottom of that page he was given, it says
"You are found to be inadmissible as charged and ordered removed from the US".

The second page is Notice to Alien Ordered Removed/Departure Verification.
"You have been found to be inadmissible to the US under the provisions of section 212(a) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (Act) or deportable under the provisions of section 237 of the Act as a Visa Waiver Pilot Program violator. In accordance with the provisions of section 212 (a)(9) of the Act, you are prohibited from entering, attempting to enter, or being in the US for a period of 5 years from the date of your departure from the US as a consequence of your having been found inadmissible as an arriving alien in proceedings under section 235(b)(1) or 240 of the Act.

Further down the page;

After your deportation or removal has been effected, if you desire to reenter the US within the period during which you are barred, you must request and obtain permission from the Attorney General to reapply for admission to the US. You must obtain such permission before commencing your travel to the US. Application forms for requesting such permission may be obtained by contacting any US Consulate or office of the US Immigration and Naturalization Service.

Sooooooooo....now that all the technicalities are out of the way, this is my question.

I have been informed right or wrong that we need to file either an I-192 or an I-212 for a waiver for him to enter the US. I dont know the difference and I have no clue as to which one we work torwards. Was he actually deported ??? He never offically entered the US I guess. They never asked him to voluntarily leave. They just asked our sides of the story. As to why we were entering the US together. We both lied the first time. The 2nd time, they threatned my job etc and I caved naturally. He went ahead after threats of arresting him and they ended up doing so. They said they would allow me to take him back home however in which I did. So. Basically we know or we think we do that we need to file a fiance visa correct? And additionally a waiver. But which one? And in any particular order? I know I need to file the Fiance Visa here, and he files the waiver there. But thats really all. I have no clue of where to go beyond that. When, where, what, how etc. And is there anything I'm missing that I should know about???
Any post regarding this would be greatly apprecited!!! Thanks so much! Lisa

[kenaly]

1-192 is for him to VISIT the USA..it was taking close to a year for those when we looked into it in Toronto. You file the fiance visa, he will be denied at the interview and then you will file the waiver. His interview will be in Montreal and I am sorry to say that the processing time for Canada waivers is at the minimum 1 year based on what information other members and attorneys tell this site.

I can't offer anything on the I-212, as we needed the I-601, but others on here will chime in shortly.

[jesuslovesyou]

i-192 is temp waiver which canadians can file directly with the DHS no visa or consulte nessary but can take close to 1 year o more its also called 212(d)(3)

alternaively he can also apply for visa at consulate as visa waiver violator he cant enter on canadian passport without visa so u can go to consulate and apply for Visit visa and consulate can then recomend for waiver to DHS and this can take 4 to 6 weeks extra this waiver is same as above.


and there is i-212 pemenent waiver ..you normally apply this with a Visa such a H , L , K or a green card application you can apply directly to the port where you have been depoted or to the service center where you are applying for your i-130 this takes 6 months


any further info need post hear also read the posting on 212(d)(3) and i-212 adjucation process in this forum

Godbless

JLU

[kitkat1]

As Kenaly explained, you start by filing the I-129F paperwork. Once approved and he goes to the interview, he will be denied. You'll need to submit a waiver and hardship letter and wait for a decision. Seems like right now it's closer to 18 months. Start by reading here -- it's geared towards 601 waivers but it will give you a good overview:http://www.familybasedimmigration.com/forum/waivers.php

Then read the waiver information in my signature as well as the approved and denied hardship letters on this site. You should also consult with a qualified attorney to be sure you understand the charges and exactly how to address them in the waiver letter.

[jesuslovesyou]

all the posts kitkat gave are for 601 which is significantly defferent both in procedure and qualifications .. they will give u a lil insight of how hardshipwivers are processed but not 212.


212 and i-192 are very very defferet and dont get confused with 601 wiavers

you need to first deside what visa u want to apply


JLU

[kitkat1]

The basics of hardship letters for 212 waivers are the exactly the same as 601 waivers. The applicant is still required to prove extreme hardship to the US qualifying relative. Certainly reading some overviews and getting acquainted with the basic approach cannot hurt.

significantly defferent both in procedure and qualifications
In what specific way?

This is a case of a deportation of a fiance of a USC - not a criminal and no reason to believe there are other extenuating circumstances that could negatively affect a decision. The procedure is not unlike that of a illegal presence of a fiance of a USC. Before an applicant can file a 601, he first has to be determined to need one, then he has to be determined to be eligible. Same procedure for 212. Perhaps the only important other factor is when the deporation took place vs. when the waiver is filed. Other than that, I cannot see anything "significantly different" in procedure or qualification - again, as a USC fiance, he's qualified.

An I-92 doesn't make any sense if she is going to pursue a fiance visa.

[jesuslovesyou]

i-212 is not basied on any qualification no USC spouse is required ..and no hardship is required rather its done on pure discriminatory ..please READ USCIS pubished adjucation procedure ..you never seem to READ before you answer:)


and how I-212 is processed and applied is very defferent ..no need to argue its neither me or you who desides DHS is the one desides .. I tell this things coz I am applying for the same ..we reserched applyed and saw all the aspects of it even collected information from ppl who got approved and denied .

you are confused with ppl who apply for 601 and 212 together ..when both 601 and 212 both are required USCIS PROCESSES THEM TOGETHER all the information you been arguing about scicne last 1 yr applying to only that one case .and it belings to 601 forum ..this forum is for ppl who need only 212 thats the reason we have defferent forms.


peace

JLU

[kitkat1]

KitKat t would be good not to give wrong information ...and dont mix 601 forum info into i-212 they r defferent .

Again, can you provide further information as I requested about why this information is "wrong"?

i-212 is not basied on any qualification no USC spouse is required ..and no hardship is required rather its done on pure discriminatory ..please READ USCIS pubished adjucation procedure ..you never seem to READ before you answer:)

Looks like YOU didn't read. I asked you to explain what was the "significantly defferent both in procedure and qualifications" between a 212 and a 601 IN THIS SPECIFIC CASE.

Facts:

1) Fiance of USC (not crewman or one of the other situations that would make a 212 different
2) Deported (no other apparent reason for needing a 212)


Mindful by recent case law, the Immigration and Naturalization Service established criteria to be applied to determine whether an alien should be granted readmission. The criteria include establishing good moral character, recency of the deportation, the need for applicant’s services in the United States, and length of time applicant had been in the United States. This list of criteria should not be considered exhaustive, and an I-212 waiver applicant should be prepared to submit additional information that makes his or her waiver stand out. Mere existence of a United States family alone is most often not enough for a successful waiver. An I-212 waiver should evidence the alien’s good moral character and that the alien’s exclusion from the United States would result in not only extreme hardship to the alien but more importantly to their United States family.

Although the Immigration and Naturalization Service did not specifically set forth hardship as a criterion for an I-212 waiver, evidence of hardship to an alien’s United States family is considered essential for a successful I-212 waiver. Indeed, almost all families suffer hardship as a result of the separation caused by immigration removal. However, an I-212 waiver should evidence hardship that is unusual, whether that hardship includes health, financial, education or personal considerations such as close relatives in the United States or length of residence in the United States. Immigration officials will also take into consideration special factors such as cultural, language, religious and ethnic obstacles. A well-prepared I-212 waiver should demonstrate hardship above and beyond what immigration official might be used to seeing.


..this forum is for ppl who need only 212 thats the reason we have defferent forms.


I2us is also about providing accurate information.

[jesuslovesyou]

Hahaha Kitkat

you seem to be obcessed with attorney reeves ...thats his argument ..and FYI even in that USC spouse or extreme hadship is not nessasry ..stop being adamant you dont know a single thing about 212 did u apply for one ?

Read in to what DHS wants not what some attorney who wanna make money posts on website FYI postings posted by reeves are have too many flaws ..such as he assumes that ppl need to apply 212(d)(3) and 212 also to come back ..well yes if he wants to make money robing you ..they both are for same purpose .


and READ YOUR OWN POSTING before you submit

[kitkat1]

As I have repeatedly asked you, it would be a lot more helpful if you provided information that differs from what I have (not your opinion but actual 212 guideslines from DHS for THIS PARTICULAR SITUATION where the fiance of a USC was deported)

I never said I was 100% right. I asked you to provide information that shows the differences in how the hardship letter needs to be approached between a 212 and 601.

No reason for your to be so argumentative or rude. I'm not at all interested in arguing with you. I am simply trying to provide some accurate and complete information to the OP. If you can assist by doing that, it would be helpful. If not, no matter. I'm finished here.

[jesuslovesyou]

1. She never applied for fiance visa so ..s per USCIS there is no fiance yet

2. they never had any ovesaty so they dont need to apply 601


and as I said they need to apply for i-212 if they want pemenent relif and 212(d)(3) for temp relif your 601 doent come into play

qualification for 601 is to show extreme hardship to the USC ...there is no set qualification for 212 but DHS weighs positive factors to negetive factors nd 212 is much more leninet that 601



Thats why i said dont give info that you dont know ...almost 1 yr u been doing the same ...



as you can see ..hardships to USC spouse can also be considered as favorable factors ..there is no need to show etreme hardship ..like in 601 ..not everybody are able to show extreme hardship other factors are also considered .

there are ppl who didnt have any USC spouse and got 212 approved



and for 212(d)(3) having USC spouse will not not play any roll at all they just want to know that you are not a threat to national security and you have a valid reson to visit

JLU

http://www.immigrate2us.net/forum/showthread.php?p=2600

[Marie]

JLU, Kitkat never said that she needed the I601 or that you needed to have a USC relative to file the 212.

She simply stated that the 601 waivers could help her in writing her 212. There is no need to continue your tirades..and i deleted the comments you made which were completely uncalled for.

[Lulu]

Ok, let me try to clear a few things up, both in general as well as how they apply in this case. I am not a total expert in this, but based on what I've read:

1. JLU, you are correct in that when I-212 is NOT filed with I-601, the procedures and requirements are different. The I-212 CAN be filed and decided without any qualifying USC relatives. Not based on hardship to a USC spouse, but rather the overall positive factors in the case outweighing the negatives. The alien's good moral character, the alien's hardships, the circumstances of the alien's case, etc. CAN be taken into account. However, it needs to be said that when there are USC or LPR family members, hardships to them are taken into strong consideration. Therefore, kitkat had good reason to recommend checking out the I-601 hardship letters. They certainly would not hurt the case, but would help tremendously - in this situation.

2. When filed with an I-601 waiver, the I-212 is generally decided however the I-601 is. In other words, if the I-601 is approved, then the I-212 will be too.

3. LISAMARIE - From what your wrote, your fiance was indeed ordered removed, which for all purposes, is considered deportation. As was already stated, the I-192 would be useless as he intends to marry and live with you. But, don't file the I-212 yet either. If you are going to petition him, wait until the interview to file the waiver. If by chance his I-212 is approved in advance, he still may be denied a tourist visa, or denied entrance to the US because they will assume he is trying to remain in the US and marry you. Start the K1 process (or if you're planning to marry, then the I-130), and go from there.

In THIS case, I have reason to believe that BOTH I-601 and I-212 waivers WILL be required. While the official documentation your fiance was given states "212(a)(7)(A)(i)(I)" as the reason for being denied admission, the lies your fiance told will likely emerge during the K1 visa interview, and will be ruled as misrepresentation (misrepresenting material facts in order to gain entrance to the US). This carries a lifetime ban which can be cured with an I-601 waiver, which will be filed with the I-212. So yes, at this point, I would prepare to submit both.

[jesuslovesyou]

cool with me ..as long as we dont give wrong info nd waste ppls time and effots

Lisamarie

in my opinion I strongly suggest not to apply for K1 if you can qualify for any other non immigrant Visa.


1. i-192 you can apply antime but wasting 1 yr to get it might not be of any sense and besides as a Visa Waiver Violator DHS ma not let him use Visa Waiver program ..he need to apply for Visa.

2. if you apply for k1 and geting it approved and then interview and apply 212 as they only accept 212 as k1 leads to an immigrant visa anyway they might not recomend 212(d)(3) ..this 212 can go forever read others postings who tried to apply 212 through consulate ( read ppl who applied for 212 only not 601 and 212) this is a nightmare.

3.if you can qualify for any NIV through consulate even B1 B2 L H E includng TN visa they will recomend 212(d)(3) and they will process it much faster ..consulate canot refuse to recomend your waiver ..they can add their opinion positive or negetive .

so you can do all the same hardwork and make an agument for 212(d)(3) which can be approved prety quick and then once ur incountry apply for your Immigrant Visa and 212

thats my take on it




lulu is right on misrepresentation thing ..... but we dont know untill consulate desides on it when you apply for it.


either way your non immigrant waiver 212(d)(3) will cover tha aswell ..

you canot apply 212 by itself it has to be tied to some visa applicaion ..i mean you cant just fill it up and mail it you need an approved visa or apply along with it .

if you have patience to wait apply 212 along with your i-130 petetion this will save time